65 thoughts on “Boeing Powerpoint Slide Shows PoK With Pakistan”
Joel
LOL! Nice catch 😉 I hope whoever put this presentation together is corrected. But im sure under pressure and part ignorance can lead to such mistakes. Unless he got his secretary to do this in which case … What did you expect 😛
Given the tendency to paint the whole region in off color or worse chop it off entirely, this is not that disconcerting. For better or worse, entertaining reality that PoK is full rabid Paki's now compared to Kashmiri's might be a good thing.
POK is under PAK and as long as we in India accept the LOC as our border it will remain so. AFAIK we have no intentions of taking POK, we do claim it but the reality is that unless there is a massive war with PAK we cant take or claim POK for ourselves. the map just reflects this reality.
POK is not under Indian control since Indian army, police force is not posted there. So in truth PAk is in control of this region. if we dont want people show the truth, we have to attack and procure this region/..
Outside India, usually, Indian map is without POK and Chinese occupied Kashmir. Don't believe me, go to local supermarket and check out Indian map on various Indian teas. Given how things are outside India Indian map is different. My question is which one is correct and which one is propaganda? POK is not Indian is it?
i have a simple solution. give these bastards at boeing a choice. choose which country you would rather have as a defence market — india or pakistan. based on that, redraw the map. if they refuse, take their F-18 bid and shove it up the indian country head's arse.
stuff like this cannot be ignored as an error. companies like boeing spend millions lobbying governments like india's for contracts. kashmir is a sensitive enough issue for such a depiction to be raised. but what is the protocol? should the MoD complain to the MEA, or should it complain directly to the US Embassy? Let's be very clear about one thing: these are not minor issues. Anyone who suggests so does not understand the huge implications.
Though it's a glaring faux pas to include such a map in a sales pitch to Indian defence establishment, the bitter truth is that maps like these reflect the true de facto position. Almost all foreign maps are like this. It is Pakistan not India that exercises sovereignty over PoK. There is little India has done to get PoK back, other than needlessly taking the dispute to UN. In fact, BBC news telecasts beamed into India are a lot worse in this respect. BBC's South Asian maps show even the Indian-administered Kashmir outside of India.
What is so wrong about this? This is what it is on the ground. Thank them that they are still showing a large part of India captured by China as Indian territory.
Where is the outrage in Japan because Kyushu and Hokkaido, two of the home islands are not shown as part of Japan. Boeing also seems to be leaving out Hawaii and Puerto Rico from the US, maybe they have other sinister motives. The map is in accordance with the UN-brokered LoC, what more is there to cry about?
All international sources consider PoK as part of Pak, nothing wrong with that. Internationally, even if the area is disputed it will be shown in map of a country which is currently occupying it. I wonder why didn't they show Aksai Chin under china.
To be honest, POK is under Pakistan control from a long time…. we are just paper tigers, fighting for it in this ridiculous way…. give up, and embrace the reality… and dont rant abt symbolism and bla bla bla
this is correct..simply because india doesnt have the balls to take pok back…what's the point in protesting?…has protesting stopped terrorsim?…changing the map of boeing won't make a difference…we should claim and sieze pok…india is a elephant scared of an ant..pakistan..sickening…
Changing all those maps is not going to change the real geographic truth!! Changing it on paper is just a boost to our highly inflated egos. Let's try to do something on ground or lets just shut up.
Wooopty do ? POK has been part of Pakistan for decades. Lets first bring back J&K back to normalcy, then we can decide whether to claim POK. POK is a dead piece of land for India to claim, like it or not.
So what's the big deal. POK is indeed in Pakistan and hence the 'P' in POK. When will we learn to be a little less sensitive about POK. That part is gone forever. Time to smell the coffee.
Shiv, Once i threw out one of the advertising agency in the pitch process when they came with the wrong map for presentation. They had downloaded it. Well, this is the way Unkil, encourages wink -wink to the Munna, Pakistan. This is to keep us on the backfoot. Given the climate in MMS era (Supreme rule of Unkil in ministries) I am sure our younger babus( enamored by MMS) would have ignored it or would have found it embarrassing to tell it to boieng.
Where are Dixits and Parthasarthy of the world. we just have a Moronic Shiv shankar menon, who wants 'Piss' with pakistan as they are also victim of terrorism only. Unkil ask me to bend , I crawl. S-e-S and now Thimpu.
Sorry for the rant but MMS is taking the country down the drain and he is obsessed with Unkil and making Piss with Pakistan.
Here's the legal position with respect to publication of such maps:
1.According to the Criminal Law Amendment Act, 1961 (as originally enacted) questioning the territorial integrity or frontiers of India in a manner prejudicial to the interests of safety and security of India is an offence punishable with imprisonment for a term extending up to three years or with fine or with both. It is arguable whether publishing maps such as this one amounts to questioning the territorial integrity or frontiers of India in a manner prejudicial to the interests of safety and security of India. It may or it may not.
2. To make the position w.r.t. such maps more clear, the said law was amended in 1990. Now Section 2 (2) expressly prohibits the publication of a map of India which is not in conformity with the maps of India as published by the Survey of India. Contravention of the said provision is punishable with imprisonment which may extend to six months or with fine or with both.
3. However, no court can take cognisance of an offence punishable under Section 2 (2) except on a complaint made by the Government.
So, none of us can lodge a complaint against Boeing in court. We can only write to GOI.
Its amazing how many indian live in the Bollywood fairy tale all the time. This Powerpoint shows you what the average westerner thinks of india and its importance. Nothing….nada…zilch.
Think for a moment if india disappeared from the face of the planet, would anyone miss it? Ok cheap programmers who smell of currey….but chinese can fill that gap now….otherthan that maybe pakistan, it won't have any enemy to hate and demean.
Similarly other than the US..any Western country can disappear with absolutely no effect to anybody. The European countries are so insignificant on their own that now they have group themselves as one to get a word.
Marcus, We existed long before Europeans learnt to speak. When your ancestors were living in caves and hanging on trees we had a civilsation running, As for missing India, well what you learnt in school counting 0,1,2,3…. is a gift of my civilsation state. Anyway you wont understand the term 'civilisation state', you only know of 'nation state'.
We were 23% of global GDP in 1897 before the looters,Brits funded the entire WWI and WWII by shafting us. Anyway Karma is catching up with the English 'Bankrupt' nation. Watch 20 years India is coming to be your net donor. In some way we are still the financers of US($280 billion reserves) abd yes we can buy out the bankrupt nation. We have the world's largest gold reserve on citizens hands – 30000 tons. Next is US with overall GOTUS + Citizen at 5000 tons.
We were 10000 years abck and we will be 10000 years hence. Think of yourself.
Guys, stop behaving like chinese, that you invented numbers, algebra, etc…all that generally belongs to the arabs.
The old civilasation or harappa (?) etc, were in what is Pakistan today. Oh before you say it was all india then, sorry harappa, taxila were even then separate nations. Infact there were many nations in place of india then all with different cultures, languages etc…Just like europe is today.
India was great before but under the rule of muslims. However they had slightly different ways of doing things. Current indian leaders do not have the same principle as those guys.
In no way do i mean to belittle india but you need to get real and live in the current world.
If you are a history student, you have a lot of studying to do before your exams if you don't want to flunk. Harappa, Mohenjodaro, Taxila existed as CIVILIZATIONS under Hindu/Buddhist rule – not under Islam. They were destroyed by Hun and later Mongol and Arab invasions.
The Islamic rulers that you speak of came much later and established the Moghul and later Deccan sultanates.
Also, go read where the Arabic numerals, the concept of zero, Aryabhatta, Bhaskara and a lot of other math-related stuff came from. You will be surprised.
As for curry smelling programmers, without them, many big, medium and small American corporations would have folded a long time ago from paying their inefficient American employees their inflated salaries.
It doesn't matter what was the religion of Taxila, harappa, etc….point is they were in todays pakistan and not in todays india. They existed as separate nations, with own language, culture and kingships. They did not have the concept of India. Infact they hated and were at war with what is parts of India now. This is the same story of empires throughout the world not just the south asian sub-continent. To claim them as part of india is kind of stretching the truth a bit. Its like chinese claimiing mongolians are chinese :-). By the way can you tell me who gave you the name India?
I also agree that there were many other great empires in what is today Indian landscape. However none of them had any clout on the global scale until the arrival of the Muslims in the 7th century onwards. They unified india by conquest and took it to levels never seen before.
Wrong Marcus…Muslims NEVER united India. The greatest Muslim empire the Mughal's at her peak(in the 1600's not the 7th century when there were no Muslims at all as Islam only existed after Mohammed in 600 AD) never covered what is India today. The South was never under the Mughals neither was the North East.Infact the Mauryan Empire covered more of India than the Mughals did at her peak.
The only entity in history who united India as India today is the British.
There is confusion here of the concept of a civilization state versus a nation state. India as a nation state has existed only 62 years but on a civilizational state India has existed for thousands of years. Unlike the Pakistanis who seem to detest their thousands of years of pre Islamic history and culture and only embrace the last 700-800 years of Islamic history brought ironically to them by invaders,Indians consider the Indus valley civilization as the base of the Indian civilization irrespective of the fact that the actual site is now in Pakistan. It is similar to how the Russian civilization rose in what is now Ukraine but the fact that the location is in Ukraine does not make it any less the base of the Russian civilization.
@ Marcus: Think of the Americans who obviously don't think of the rest of the world other than themselves: have u heard of ur much revered World series Superbowl? i have not heard of any countries other than the states of USA participating..wonder how that becomes a world series cup, and mate, regarding the importance of india, Not for nothing are your leading defence firms like Boeing/Lockheed Martin queuing up and waiting for billions of dollars of orders to cure the impending unemployment and closure of f-16 factories in Texas and other places. So in the future years if India vanishes, Americans who are so used to living on credit, it would take years to wipe out the mortgage.. and when that happens.. don't blame the curry munching Indians..neither call a call center in India 4 help.. face it dude.. ur country is increasingly relying on India and other emerging markets for growth so that we can buy your products, as the Americans themselves have no money to buy.. Hey Marcus: do you even know of the term "emerging market"? Its not your fault, coz an average American with low IQ like urs doesnt know the term rest of the world..
Do you think the romans ever cared about the emerging world? When you are "it", do the others matter? If USA wants it can bring india to its knees faster then you can type the reply. All without firing a single bullet.
I know the difference between civilization and nation. Can you imagine British claiming Greek civilazation as their own because they are on the same continent. A distance less than from Taxila to Mumbai or most of india.
Some of you guys really need to read your history, how Muslims not just the Moguls united india by putting a super structure above the existing states and collecting Taxes.
You are the one who does not know history..which Muslim empire controlled India as it is today? I am from the southern state of Kerala in India. No Muslims ever ruled us…NEVER in history. Neighboring lands were ruled during periods by Muslims but it never lasted. I suggest you stop teaching Indian history to Indians.
Marcus/Mohammed…you sound a lot like a Paki who thinks that the 800 year old Muslim rule in Delhi(not even India) somehow gave us Indian's civilization. A laughable claim considering that 800 years is but a blink in the no of years civilization existed in India.
But those periods were longer in duration than the current nation of india. And also remember those states not conquered outright were vassel/impotent states, posing no threat.
Anyway this is my last point.Nice chatting with you guy.
I am pretty sure Marcus is nothing but a Paki hiding under an assumed personality of an American. Muslims brought greatness to India?haha…pretty sure he learned that from a madrassa.
Why do you Pakis hate your own culture while following an alien religion of the Arabs?
However badly India is doing..Marcus(Paki in disguise),it is certainly better than what the great land of the pure..run by the Muslims, Pakistan is doing. Atleast we are not dependent on aid to survive.
Ok Marcus, lets forget the ancient history for a moment, lets go in the past 30-40 years or so..to make it easier 4 u.. Americans tried to squeeze Vietnam, but got a bloody nose. Also your much vaunted CIA and its latest spy satellites cud not even detect the Indian nuclear tests of 1998 before we announced them. You did try to squeeze India with the sanctions post the 1998 nuclear tests, but unfortunately most of the lucrative business contracts started going to the countries from EU as India liberalised further, and EU has comparable if not better technology than your over rated products, and USA had to awaken itself to the harsh economic realities of the day and the sanctions had to be removed. So live in the present and live in the real world, its an inter-dependent world and USA cant dream of squeezing any country it wishes without facing any repercussions 4 itself. Spare a thought for your comrades in Iraq and Afghanistan, even people in such seemingly insignificant countries (as u may think) are impacting you on a daily basis, even though they are not obviously as powerful as the mighty USA. Also, USA has been trying squeeze countries like Venezuela, but to no avail (Chavez buys latest Russian weapons and openly defies you)..Oh oh where is Uncle Sam's magic..It isn't working in its own backyard..!!!So think of these factors b4 having any illusions that Americans will be the outright winners of the the 126 MMRCA $ 10 billion contract of the Indian Air Force among many multi-billion dollar purchases of the Indian armed forces, for which the various defence companies and governments including yours are lobbying alongside many multi billion dollar business investments happening in the country. Thank god most of the American leadership atleast at the outset is not afflicted by the cold war mindset that possesses you…again face it dude, USA is not the world..maybe Romans were "it" back in the ancient times, but USA definitely certainly isn't..NOW..
Miss u Marcus, i guess not all discussions are won with advanced weapons.. hope u r back having refreshed urself with ur own history, b4 trying 2 teach Indians their history..
Marcus/Mohammed…there was no single Muslim rule in India. There were various muslims rulers who fought among themselves and other Hindu rulers.However no Muslim ruler ever conquered India as it stands today or were responsible for giving India "civilization"…I don't care what your Madrassa thought you.
On Google maps, Wikipedia, BBC World, or just any other open source international agency shows PoK under Pak, and IoK under India. It's simply being neutral.
I don't think Boeing did it on purpose. Their Jr. assistant manager must've blindly downloaded it, and pasted it there. The Indo-Pak border dispute and ensuing sensitivities must've been the last thing on the poor bloke's mind.
Because Pakis are like the retarded cousin who keeps coming back to fight again and again against the bigger brother even after getting his ass whipped multiple times.
Funny Pakis consider themselves masters of Hindus as they are nothing but Hindus converted by the Arabs and Persians….the Hindus of India managed to hold on to their culture and religion under tremendous odds while the Hindus of Pakistan lost their religion and culture to the alien invaders. And now they are the masters?
LOL! Nice catch 😉 I hope whoever put this presentation together is corrected. But im sure under pressure and part ignorance can lead to such mistakes. Unless he got his secretary to do this in which case … What did you expect 😛
Given the tendency to paint the whole region in off color or worse chop it off entirely, this is not that disconcerting. For better or worse, entertaining reality that PoK is full rabid Paki's now compared to Kashmiri's might be a good thing.
Oh and they want Indian market to keep their profits growing. Imagine what would have happened if Boeing had showed Tibet to be an independent nation.
I guess it's okay,after all,they are controlling it.
Its unacceptable , i wonder what India is doing , keeping quiet .
Boeing supplying and gaining from india ,and working truely for Pakistan .
POK is under PAK and as long as we in India accept the LOC as our border it will remain so. AFAIK we have no intentions of taking POK, we do claim it but the reality is that unless there is a massive war with PAK we cant take or claim POK for ourselves. the map just reflects this reality.
google shows that…its becoming comn outside india. India and pak show it as their part.
When will we start caliing a spade a spade??
POK is not under Indian control since Indian army, police force is not posted there. So in truth PAk is in control of this region. if we dont want people show the truth, we have to attack and procure this region/..
I remember it's the second time Shiv has picked this. God job Shiv…..
did we register our protest with boeing? any idea?
Did we register any protest with Boeing?
during the international trade fair in delhi…
one chinese company dared to show show arunanchal pradesh as there own part…!!!
Outside India, usually, Indian map is without POK and Chinese occupied Kashmir. Don't believe me, go to local supermarket and check out Indian map on various Indian teas.
Given how things are outside India Indian map is different.
My question is which one is correct and which one is propaganda?
POK is not Indian is it?
i have a simple solution. give these bastards at boeing a choice. choose which country you would rather have as a defence market — india or pakistan. based on that, redraw the map. if they refuse, take their F-18 bid and shove it up the indian country head's arse.
stuff like this cannot be ignored as an error. companies like boeing spend millions lobbying governments like india's for contracts. kashmir is a sensitive enough issue for such a depiction to be raised. but what is the protocol? should the MoD complain to the MEA, or should it complain directly to the US Embassy? Let's be very clear about one thing: these are not minor issues. Anyone who suggests so does not understand the huge implications.
Though it's a glaring faux pas to include such a map in a sales pitch to Indian defence establishment, the bitter truth is that maps like these reflect the true de facto position. Almost all foreign maps are like this. It is Pakistan not India that exercises sovereignty over PoK. There is little India has done to get PoK back, other than needlessly taking the dispute to UN. In fact, BBC news telecasts beamed into India are a lot worse in this respect. BBC's South Asian maps show even the Indian-administered Kashmir outside of India.
What is so wrong about this? This is what it is on the ground. Thank them that they are still showing a large part of India captured by China as Indian territory.
Where is the outrage in Japan because Kyushu and Hokkaido, two of the home islands are not shown as part of Japan. Boeing also seems to be leaving out Hawaii and Puerto Rico from the US, maybe they have other sinister motives. The map is in accordance with the UN-brokered LoC, what more is there to cry about?
All international sources consider PoK as part of Pak, nothing wrong with that. Internationally, even if the area is disputed it will be shown in map of a country which is currently occupying it. I wonder why didn't they show Aksai Chin under china.
Aksi Chan is label under India, pathetic, Am I gonna complain to boeing, no!
To be honest, POK is under Pakistan control from a long time…. we are just paper tigers, fighting for it in this ridiculous way…. give up, and embrace the reality… and dont rant abt symbolism and bla bla bla
That's Great to see & hear. Fingers Crossed.
this is correct..simply because india doesnt have the balls to take pok back…what's the point in protesting?…has protesting stopped terrorsim?…changing the map of boeing won't make a difference…we should claim and sieze pok…india is a elephant scared of an ant..pakistan..sickening…
Changing all those maps is not going to change the real geographic truth!!
Changing it on paper is just a boost to our highly inflated egos. Let's try to do something on ground or lets just shut up.
Let Boeing take their Hornets and shove it up their arse.
All maps uaed internationally are like this only. So whats the fuss about?
This is a marketing ploy by the company – buy our weapons and get PoK back – or else lose the rest of J&K!
Wooopty do ? POK has been part of Pakistan for decades. Lets first bring back J&K back to normalcy, then we can decide whether to claim POK. POK is a dead piece of land for India to claim, like it or not.
Not a big deal. India is a cry baby..
Cannot do anything about.. so it raises red herrings..
So what's the big deal. POK is indeed in Pakistan and hence the 'P' in POK. When will we learn to be a little less sensitive about POK. That part is gone forever. Time to smell the coffee.
Shiv,
Once i threw out one of the advertising agency in the pitch process when they came with the wrong map for presentation. They had downloaded it.
Well, this is the way Unkil, encourages wink -wink to the Munna, Pakistan. This is to keep us on the backfoot. Given the climate in MMS era (Supreme rule of Unkil in ministries) I am sure our younger babus( enamored by MMS) would have ignored it or would have found it embarrassing to tell it to boieng.
Where are Dixits and Parthasarthy of the world. we just have a Moronic Shiv shankar menon, who wants 'Piss' with pakistan as they are also victim of terrorism only. Unkil ask me to bend , I crawl. S-e-S and now Thimpu.
Sorry for the rant but MMS is taking the country down the drain and he is obsessed with Unkil and making Piss with Pakistan.
Here's the legal position with respect to publication of such maps:
1.According to the Criminal Law Amendment Act, 1961 (as originally enacted) questioning the territorial integrity or frontiers of India in a manner prejudicial to the interests of safety and security of India is an offence punishable with imprisonment for a term extending up to three years or with fine or with both. It is arguable whether publishing maps such as this one amounts to questioning the territorial integrity or frontiers of India in a manner prejudicial to the interests of safety and security of India. It may or it may not.
2. To make the position w.r.t. such maps more clear, the said law was amended in 1990. Now Section 2 (2) expressly prohibits the publication of a map of India which is not in conformity with the maps of India as published by the Survey of India. Contravention of the said provision is punishable with imprisonment which may extend to six months or with fine or with both.
3. However, no court can take cognisance of an offence punishable under Section 2 (2) except on a complaint made by the Government.
So, none of us can lodge a complaint against Boeing in court. We can only write to GOI.
Its amazing how many indian live in the Bollywood fairy tale all the time. This Powerpoint shows you what the average westerner thinks of india and its importance. Nothing….nada…zilch.
Think for a moment if india disappeared from the face of the planet, would anyone miss it? Ok cheap programmers who smell of currey….but chinese can fill that gap now….otherthan that maybe pakistan, it won't have any enemy to hate and demean.
Comeon guys think.
Similarly other than the US..any Western country can disappear with absolutely no effect to anybody. The European countries are so insignificant on their own that now they have group themselves as one to get a word.
and middle eastern countries where they like to slap indians…hahaha
Marcus,
We existed long before Europeans learnt to speak. When your ancestors were living in caves and hanging on trees we had a civilsation running, As for missing India, well what you learnt in school counting 0,1,2,3…. is a gift of my civilsation state. Anyway you wont understand the term 'civilisation state', you only know of 'nation state'.
We were 23% of global GDP in 1897 before the looters,Brits funded the entire WWI and WWII by shafting us. Anyway Karma is catching up with the English 'Bankrupt' nation. Watch 20 years India is coming to be your net donor. In some way we are still the financers of US($280 billion reserves) abd yes we can buy out the bankrupt nation. We have the world's largest gold reserve on citizens hands – 30000 tons. Next is US with overall GOTUS + Citizen at 5000 tons.
We were 10000 years abck and we will be 10000 years hence. Think of yourself.
Tons of people in the spiritual world (which I guess you have no idea how huge they are would !) would miss India.
I guess, you need to understand other aspects of India than just curry, smelling programmers and Bollywood !
Oh, who cares?!
Guys, stop behaving like chinese, that you invented numbers, algebra, etc…all that generally belongs to the arabs.
The old civilasation or harappa (?) etc, were in what is Pakistan today. Oh before you say it was all india then, sorry harappa, taxila were even then separate nations. Infact there were many nations in place of india then all with different cultures, languages etc…Just like europe is today.
India was great before but under the rule of muslims. However they had slightly different ways of doing things. Current indian leaders do not have the same principle as those guys.
In no way do i mean to belittle india but you need to get real and live in the current world.
India was great BEFORE Mohammed was even born. Your world history is sorely lacking Marcus but that is expected of an American.
Ever heard of the Mauryas,the Guptas,the Nandas.the Cholas etc?
To say that Indian history of great empires began with the Muslims is just stupid.
@Marcus
If you are a history student, you have a lot of studying to do before your exams if you don't want to flunk. Harappa, Mohenjodaro, Taxila existed as CIVILIZATIONS under Hindu/Buddhist rule – not under Islam. They were destroyed by Hun and later Mongol and Arab invasions.
The Islamic rulers that you speak of came much later and established the Moghul and later Deccan sultanates.
Also, go read where the Arabic numerals, the concept of zero, Aryabhatta, Bhaskara and a lot of other math-related stuff came from. You will be surprised.
As for curry smelling programmers, without them, many big, medium and small American corporations would have folded a long time ago from paying their inefficient American employees their inflated salaries.
It doesn't matter what was the religion of Taxila, harappa, etc….point is they were in todays pakistan and not in todays india. They existed as separate nations, with own language, culture and kingships. They did not have the concept of India. Infact they hated and were at war with what is parts of India now. This is the same story of empires throughout the world not just the south asian sub-continent. To claim them as part of india is kind of stretching the truth a bit. Its like chinese claimiing mongolians are chinese :-). By the way can you tell me who gave you the name India?
I also agree that there were many other great empires in what is today Indian landscape. However none of them had any clout on the global scale until the arrival of the Muslims in the 7th century onwards. They unified india by conquest and took it to levels never seen before.
??? @anon ?? ???? ??? ???? ??? | If we dont have balls to sieze POK there is no point in protesting. Stupid verbal protesting does not earn you a nickle or even a dime ! On the contrary, nation looses respect. That ant-elephant analogy he/she points out is precisely correct. ??? ???? ?? ??? ???? ???? ?? ?? ???? ?????? ?????? ?????? ???? ?? ???? ??? ??? ?? ??? ???? ?? ?????? ?????? ?? ?? ????? ?? ????? ???? ??? ????? ?? ?????? ?? ???? ?? ??????? ?? ????? ???? ??? ??? ??? | ??? ????? ??? ?? ???? ??? ?? ?? ??? ?? ??? ???? ????? ??? ?? ?????? ?? ??? ????/?????? ?? ?? | ????? ???? ???/?????? ?? ???? ?? ?? ??? ????? ???? ???? ??? ?? ??????? ???? | ?? ???? ??? |
Rather surprised they show Aksai Chin as our part. Don't they know we Indians are pussy-hearted souls feeding on cow-milk and using cow-dung as energy source? Shiv, pls tell them (I am sure u've got contacts) this is nation of 1.3 (perhaps 1.4 now) billion fools/cowards. ??? ?? ???? ?? ??? ????? ???? ???, ??? ?? ???? ?????? ?? ???? ????? ?? ?? ????????? ?? ?????? ??? ?????? | ??? ??? ?????? ???? ?? ?? ?? ??? ?? ??? (paper tigers) ??? | ?? ?? ?? ???? ???? ?? ??? ?? ???? | ???? ?? ????? ?? ??????? ?? ???? ?? ????, ????????? ??-?????? ??? ??? ?? ???? ????? ?? ?? ???? ???? ! ?? ??? ?? ??? ??? ????? ????? ?? ????? ?? ?? ???? ???? ??? ? Ah, Its my frustration about India's foreign policies cluttering Shiv's lovely blog. I should stop. Hopefully he will publish my comment! If not, I wouldn't blame him.
Wrong Marcus…Muslims NEVER united India. The greatest Muslim empire the Mughal's at her peak(in the 1600's not the 7th century when there were no Muslims at all as Islam only existed after Mohammed in 600 AD) never covered what is India today. The South was never under the Mughals neither was the North East.Infact the Mauryan Empire covered more of India than the Mughals did at her peak.
The only entity in history who united India as India today is the British.
There is confusion here of the concept of a civilization state versus a nation state. India as a nation state has existed only 62 years but on a civilizational state India has existed for thousands of years. Unlike the Pakistanis who seem to detest their thousands of years of pre Islamic history and culture and only embrace the last 700-800 years of Islamic history brought ironically to them by invaders,Indians consider the Indus valley civilization as the base of the Indian civilization irrespective of the fact that the actual site is now in Pakistan. It is similar to how the Russian civilization rose in what is now Ukraine but the fact that the location is in Ukraine does not make it any less the base of the Russian civilization.
@ Marcus: Think of the Americans who obviously don't think of the rest of the world other than themselves: have u heard of ur much revered World series Superbowl? i have not heard of any countries other than the states of USA participating..wonder how that becomes a world series cup, and mate, regarding the importance of india, Not for nothing are your leading defence firms like Boeing/Lockheed Martin queuing up and waiting for billions of dollars of orders to cure the impending unemployment and closure of f-16 factories in Texas and other places. So in the future years if India vanishes, Americans who are so used to living on credit, it would take years to wipe out the mortgage.. and when that happens.. don't blame the curry munching Indians..neither call a call center in India 4 help.. face it dude.. ur country is increasingly relying on India and other emerging markets for growth so that we can buy your products, as the Americans themselves have no money to buy..
Hey Marcus: do you even know of the term "emerging market"? Its not your fault, coz an average American with low IQ like urs doesnt know the term rest of the world..
Do you think the romans ever cared about the emerging world? When you are "it", do the others matter? If USA wants it can bring india to its knees faster then you can type the reply. All without firing a single bullet.
I know the difference between civilization and nation. Can you imagine British claiming Greek civilazation as their own because they are on the same continent. A distance less than from Taxila to Mumbai or most of india.
Some of you guys really need to read your history, how Muslims not just the Moguls united india by putting a super structure above the existing states and collecting Taxes.
Marcus,
You are the one who does not know history..which Muslim empire controlled India as it is today? I am from the southern state of Kerala in India. No Muslims ever ruled us…NEVER in history. Neighboring lands were ruled during periods by Muslims but it never lasted.
I suggest you stop teaching Indian history to Indians.
Marcus/Mohammed…you sound a lot like a Paki who thinks that the 800 year old Muslim rule in Delhi(not even India) somehow gave us Indian's civilization. A laughable claim considering that 800 years is but a blink in the no of years civilization existed in India.
But those periods were longer in duration than the current nation of india. And also remember those states not conquered outright were vassel/impotent states, posing no threat.
Anyway this is my last point.Nice chatting with you guy.
I am pretty sure Marcus is nothing but a Paki hiding under an assumed personality of an American.
Muslims brought greatness to India?haha…pretty sure he learned that from a madrassa.
Why do you Pakis hate your own culture while following an alien religion of the Arabs?
However badly India is doing..Marcus(Paki in disguise),it is certainly better than what the great land of the pure..run by the Muslims, Pakistan is doing. Atleast we are not dependent on aid to survive.
Ok Marcus, lets forget the ancient history for a moment, lets go in the past 30-40 years or so..to make it easier 4 u.. Americans tried to squeeze Vietnam, but got a bloody nose. Also your much vaunted CIA and its latest spy satellites cud not even detect the Indian nuclear tests of 1998 before we announced them. You did try to squeeze India with the sanctions post the 1998 nuclear tests, but unfortunately most of the lucrative business contracts started going to the countries from EU as India liberalised further, and EU has comparable if not better technology than your over rated products, and USA had to awaken itself to the harsh economic realities of the day and the sanctions had to be removed. So live in the present and live in the real world, its an inter-dependent world and USA cant dream of squeezing any country it wishes without facing any repercussions 4 itself. Spare a thought for your comrades in Iraq and Afghanistan, even people in such seemingly insignificant countries (as u may think) are impacting you on a daily basis, even though they are not obviously as powerful as the mighty USA. Also, USA has been trying squeeze countries like Venezuela, but to no avail (Chavez buys latest Russian weapons and openly defies you)..Oh oh where is Uncle Sam's magic..It isn't working in its own backyard..!!!So think of these factors b4 having any illusions that Americans will be the outright winners of the the 126 MMRCA $ 10 billion contract of the Indian Air Force among many multi-billion dollar purchases of the Indian armed forces, for which the various defence companies and governments including yours are lobbying alongside many multi billion dollar business investments happening in the country. Thank god most of the American leadership atleast at the outset is not afflicted by the cold war mindset that possesses you…again face it dude, USA is not the world..maybe Romans were "it" back in the ancient times, but USA definitely certainly isn't..NOW..
Miss u Marcus, i guess not all discussions are won with advanced weapons.. hope u r back having refreshed urself with ur own history, b4 trying 2 teach Indians their history..
Guys…Marcus is no American.He is a Paki.
Marcus/Mohammed…there was no single Muslim rule in India. There were various muslims rulers who fought among themselves and other Hindu rulers.However no Muslim ruler ever conquered India as it stands today or were responsible for giving India "civilization"…I don't care what your Madrassa thought you.
whatever the case, Marcus is one person who is really ashamed of his country..whatever that is USA/Pakistan..very sad Marcus..
On Google maps, Wikipedia, BBC World, or just any other open source international agency shows PoK under Pak, and IoK under India. It's simply being neutral.
I don't think Boeing did it on purpose. Their Jr. assistant manager must've blindly downloaded it, and pasted it there. The Indo-Pak border dispute and ensuing sensitivities must've been the last thing on the poor bloke's mind.
Nothing to get incensed about.
Why do indians have a fixation with pakistan…and you boys want to be a superpower?
Because Pakis are like the retarded cousin who keeps coming back to fight again and again against the bigger brother even after getting his ass whipped multiple times.
I think Pak has been wipping your butts too. Paks consider themselves to be master of india and hindus especially and not cousins.
As I said they can consider themselves anything…but as they are retarded it does not matter.
Now who is getting their butt whipped can be made by looking at who was split into two and whose economy is a basket case.
Funny Pakis consider themselves masters of Hindus as they are nothing but Hindus converted by the Arabs and Persians….the Hindus of India managed to hold on to their culture and religion under tremendous odds while the Hindus of Pakistan lost their religion and culture to the alien invaders. And now they are the masters?
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