The HAL HJT-36 Sitara intermediate jet trainer won’t achieve initial operational clearance/capability (IOC) by the end of this year as planned. A report detailing fresh problems with the aircraft noticed during hot-weather trials held in Rajasthan in May this year, was received by the Air HQ on the morning of August 12. The IAF plans to induct over 200 of the aircraft. Details on the problems soon.
To think people here actually had the gumpton to question IAF's purchase of Hawk advanced trainers and ask why the great HAL couldn't develop one.
The HJT-36 should already have been inducted as per its original plans but is still in 'testing' phase. Meanwhile pilots crash and die in old Kiran trainers year after year. Likewise with the proposed HTT-40 turboprop trainer which will apparently take 6(that's what HAL says so make that 12) years to develop.
Why is HAL still having a monopoly over trainers again? Didn't Mahindra buy an Australian aerospace firm a couple years ago?
Did Mahindra buy an australian firm? Any links? Cant find any info on that news
Anon @ 5:00pm
Ever heard of google? All I had to type was 'Mahindra buys aerospace firms'. Here.
http://www.indiasharesinvestment.com/mahindra-aerospace/mahindra-acquires-2-aerospace-companies-in-australia/
http://theasiandefence.blogspot.com/2010/04/mahindra-acquires-2-australian.html
I'm not a big fan of DRDO but what does hot weather trials in Rajastan have to do with a trainer? Are the pilots going to train in Rajastan in the middle of summer, most of the time?
Thia is analysis paralysis at its best. The problem of having to train in Rajastan, in the middle of summer can be fixed in future upgrades.
… also what % of the intermediate pilot training happens in Rajastan?
What does DRDO have to do with Sitara? And what kind of pompous fool keeps his id as godkingofdivineroad?
Time to break the monopoly of DRDO … open the development to Tata power and Mahindras … We often worry about the enemies across the border .. what about the enemies within who keep us weak while being in the system ….
they want to stall the program so that they can order trainers from abroad siting reasons like delays in the program.
They dont complain when russia sells them crappy hardware.
Folks ,
No pro's and cons' please . Let the airforce decide about what they need and instead of merely requesting/recommending/moaning and griping , they should go and buy the damn trainer if the local products are going to be delayed .
What prevents AM Naik to go to the PM and force the issue ? Will Man S say No if the issues are forcefully raised.
India is not an aerospace manufacturing country. Everyone knows that . But there is no harm in trying to become one. The main thing is that lies and dishonesty about non existing capabilities harms the defense – and that is where the problem lies.There has been so much gas about the LCA that we are discussing Mk2 without even seeing the Mk1.
to the pea brained arm chair defence expert suggesting that Mahindra be asked to do it….
go read…one company builds single engine prop driven a/c
the other is a sheet metal company that supplies to the aviation sector…
and what exactly has tata designed
Anon @ 3:22PM
It's a very good start. They can take over the development of turboprop trainers or turboprop-powered UAVs for the IAF since HAL is moaning and groaning about having too many projects on its plate and not enough manpower.
The sole reason Tata and Mahindra haven't developed much till now is because defence was only opened to private sector a couple years ago and even now our MoD has a policy of favouring PSUs and doesn't give private sector any contracts to develop their capabilities.
Just like you people moan in favour of HAL for LCA, give the private sector a chance! I guarantee they'll run rings around HAL in ten years time if they had the same funding and assurance of orders.
Anon @ 3:15,
What's stopping IAF from getting what they want? The fact that they have zero control over the defence procurement process. They can neither issue tenders on their own nor make final selections and award contracts. The real power rests with the government and its babus and netas, most of which either couldn't care less about defence other than scams or have ulterior motives that hamper deals.
For example our current defence minister and MoS for defence are socialists who are ardent supporters of DRDO and the defence PSUs. If HAL claims that it can develop a cheaper product then they will block/delay IAF global tender or reduce it in size. They will similarly ignore any private sector overtures. Just like how LCA mk2 engine has been delayed past its deadline because of GTRE claiming it can develop superior Kaveri.
Hey RATSHAKER anon 3:22 PM
HAL cant even build a turbo prop plane. So if Mahindra can do better, wouldnt you say thats good?
You PSU commies would rather not have the tech than see the pvt companies take over. STUPID ratshaker, go back home
"I'm not a big fan of DRDO but what does hot weather trials in Rajastan have to do with a trainer? Are the pilots going to train in Rajastan in the middle of summer, most of the time?
Thia is analysis paralysis at its best. The problem of having to train in Rajastan, in the middle of summer can be fixed in future upgrades."
If the aeroplane doesn't work as advertised in hot weather, it cannot and should not be accepted by the IAF. Most training takes place in and around Hyderabad, which routinely sees temperatures in the mid forties in summer. If there are shortfalls in system or aircraft performance, it could prove fatal in the long run. The problems with the HPT 32 (engine cut) were pointed out time and again by the IAF, but they were forced to induct and continue operating the ac to support the PSU culture. This time I hope the AF finds the gumption to put their foot down. Also, anon, performance shortfalls cannot be 'fixed' as easily as you think. It will involve major redesign…better to do it at the acceptance stage. Last thought for you…would you be so enthusiastic to push for early induction of an underperforming aeroplane simply to accomodate HAL if your son were undergoing flying training on it?
If they can keep crappy state of the art russian hardware in the service and dont complain than they can also induct the indigenous hardware and let it evolve over time.
jeet,
IAF should also remember that the other alternative (foreign purchase) will take forever to execute.
Let's wait for Shiv's report to see if the fix can be done as an upgrade. If can be, IAF can always include a buy back option if they think HAL will not keep up its promise. If HAL is serious about fixing it, they should have no problem agreeing to the clause.