Wow. The contestants sure are laying the advertising on thick now that the tender is in its final stages. Seeing how the IAF has basically resigned itself to 'Give us SOMETHING, ANYTHING and we'll make it work!' it's likely the MoD will make its decision based on advertisements like these(backed up with bribes under the table) rather than what the IAF wants.
I feel a little bad for all these aerospace companies. They are marketing first-class products in a market where excellence is suppressed and merit is often ignored in favour of more sinister factors.
Just a couple of thoughts on the current MMRCA farce:
1) Circa the 1980's, after the Paks got the F-16 our airforce uncles were jolted out of their post 1971 euphoria. We suddenly realised that we didn't have an answer to the F-16. The Jags, Mig-23/27, Mig-29 just didn't fill the performance void. We continued looking for an F-16 equivalent… Then the answer came in the form of the Mirage-2000. The M2K was the perfect opposing counterpart of the F-16 – in terms of technology, performance and operation. The both were like twin brothers lost in the Kumbh Mela! Perfect! So we happily went back to our 1971 europhic slumber. 2) Cut to end 1999-early 2000s, in the Kargil war the M2K proved to the IAF what a good investment it was, with the Migs bitting the dust across the border and the Jags & others coughing & wheezing and barely making the cut. And so the good old Air Marshalls said "lets go get ourselves some more M2Ks!". Unfortunately for them, by the time the govt gives the a.o.k the french shut down the M2K production line, OOPS! So now, we go back to the story of the 1980s with a twist — THIS TIME WE ARE LOOKING FOR AN EQUIVALENT OF THE MIRAGE 2000!! 3)"MIRAGE 2000 EQUIVALENT" did you say? hmmmm…lets see… remember that twin brother of the M2K lost in the kumbh mela. Voila! The F-16IN! single-engined, middle-aged, cheap and with just enough life left in the design to last till the AMCA & PAK-FA come in. The Gripen? Nah! too close to an LCA. The MIG-35? no thanks! too many russians with us already. The others? Too heavy and an too much of an overkill. 4)So… the end of this circus was already decided. The F-16 is a perfect M2K complement, we already have enough experience running and maintaining GE engines, our avionics tech is israeli derived/assisted which is as good as saying we already operate on american avionics and only Uncle Sam can stop the Chinks from overflowing across our borders. All the pieces were in place, we only needed to put a show that we were playing a fair game and thus the MMRCA circus.
Just wait! The MMRCA is getting so much universal publicity and arousal of scientific interest, that soon the different brands of UFOs may come down with most lucrative proposals.
I am waiting for the day when the vendors will start offering a 7 day/night Thai vacation, one 2 bedroom flat in Noida/Bangalore and a Fiat Punto along with a fighter.
Superb stuff. An excellent example of bringing the aircraft to the people of the country. Specially liked the touch about 'The Future is Made in India'. That is an excellent proposition to put the issue in perspective. Hopefully all the other contenders bring out a similar special in a widely circulated daily so that we know what the IAF/MoD/ Government is going in for. Hope to see one on the Eurofighter and Rafale as well as the F-16 and F-18. Great going.
This statement was made by Bob Kemp, senior vice-president sales and marketing for Gripen International about a year ago. It basically means that they are hoping for MOD in it's true tradition to drag its feet for a few year before taking a final decision so that SAAB could have a shot since Gripen NG is likely to be ready only after 2015. EF too had hoped for AESA to come with Tranch 3 when they bid for MMRCA 2 years ago. But EF member states could not agree to it.
While no one should doubt MOD's capability to delay MMRCA to 2020 or even 2030, is this is what we want?
Very good read. Some specifics are not mentioned, but it covers the Gripen's capabilites, technology, multiple roles and readiness well. Makes a very good financial case for the aircraft and domestic technology. Directly addresses the IAF's situation and needs. Thank you for the link.
While USA is working on airborn laser kill type weaponery, with remote control pilot less plane – Indians are wasting thier money with such huge purchase despite LCA and peaceful border with Pakistan – nearly 40 years without a war, nor does India want to engage a nuclear Pakistan into it……
The Royal Thai Air Force is now a full member of the Gripen User Group, joining Sweden, Hungary, the Czech Republic and South Africa.
2010-09-02 | The Gripen User Group is a forum for Air Forces operating Gripen, providing members a unique opportunity for multinational cooperation. The group shares experiences about using the Gripen system, enabling a cost effective way for the operators to jointly develop and upgrade the system. Upgrades to Gripen are made frequently during the aircraft’s life-cycle, allowing Gripen to remain one of the most advanced fighter aircraft in the world.
Defence and security company Saab has received an order from FMV (the Swedish Defence Materiel Administration) regarding the integration of the active radar-guided Beyond Visual Range (BVR) missile, Meteor. The order is worth MSEK 312 spread over four years.
2010-09-08 | The integration means that Meteor will be adapted to other Gripen systems, such as the radar and displays. The order includes test flights and test firing, as well as the integration of Meteor with support and maintenance systems such as simulators and planning computers. The Swedish Gripen C/D aircraft will also have a two-way datalink for communication between the aircraft and the missile once it has been fired.
"Meteor has substantially better performance than any other BVR missile existing today, which will obviously increase Gripen's ability to defend against other aircraft," says Lennart Sindahl, Head of business area Aeronautics within Saab. "The fact that Gripen is also being used internationally as an airborne platform in the development of Meteor shows that we have a technical level in Sweden that few other countries can match."
Gripen has been used since 2006 as the test aircraft for the development of Meteor. Multiple missiles have been fired from Gripen to date. This experience can now be utilised for a more cost-effective integration of Meteor with the Swedish Armed Forces' Gripen C/D.
The order mainly concerns Saab's operations in Linköping and to some extent Gothenburg.
Saab serves the global market with world-leading products, services and solutions ranging from military defence to civil security. Saab has operations and employees on all continents and constantly develops adapts and improves new technology to meet customers’ changing needs.
Meteor has been designed to defeat current and future threats at beyond visual range, with an understanding performance that will totally redefine an aircraft's air combat capability. Meteor has the largest No Escape Zone of any air-to-air weapon, resulting in a long stand-off range and high kill probability that ensures air superiority and pilot survivability. The programme is on schedule to deliver the first production deliveries in 2012 and is the result of a successful six-nation European collaboration, in which Saab Dynamics of Sweden is a partner of the prime contractor, MBDA.
The Gripen is the first of the new generation fighter aircraft to enter service and the first to be used for firing Meteor, the high-tech beyond visual range missiles of the future. Using the latest available technology it is capable of performing an extensive range of air-to-air and air-to-surface operational missions and employing the latest weapons. Gripen, designed to meet the demands of current and future threats, is in service with the Swedish, Czech Republic, Hungarian and South African Air Forces and has also been ordered by the Royal Thai Air Force. The UK Empire Test Pilots´ School (ETPS) is also operating Gripen as its advanced fast jet platform for test pilots world wide.
The Gripen NG Demo is now flying with new extra large drop-tanks. Instead of the more traditional 300gallon tanks used by Gripen C/D these new external tanks can carry 450 gallons of fuel each.
Combined with added spaces for internal fuel and a more fuel efficient engine Gripen NG will get substantially longer range and more time on station. The new drop-tanks are made by RUAG in Switzerland.
Thales today announces the delivery to Saab AB of its Digital Joint Reconnaissance Pod (DJRP), for installation on the South African Gripen aircraft. Saab will now start a series of integration flight trials. This announcement is made on the occasion of the Africa Aerospace & Defence 2010 exhibition in Cape Town, South Africa.
The Thales DJRP completed its factory integration tests at Thales’s optronics facility in Glasgow in June and will now be installed on the Gripen platform. Handover of the reconnaissance pod to the South African Air Force (SAAF) will occur after the integration phase.
Christian Lamoureux, CEO of Thales South Africa, says: “We are proud of this important milestone in our long-standing relationship with the South African Air Force. We believe DJRP will provide significant improvement to the SAAF’s reconnaissance capability. We look forward to assist the SAAF with the exploitation of DJRP imagery through Thales-supplied exploitation systems.”
The DJRP is integrated onto fighter aircraft, such as the Gripen, and takes high-resolution images of the battlefield as it flies overhead. The digital images from the pod are then exploited by Image Analysts on the ground to assess what tactical decisions need to be taken. DJRP is an ideal solution for tactical electro-optic/infra-red reconnaissance requirements, providing simultaneous high-resolution/wide-area coverage.
Alex Cresswell, Thales Vice President in charge of Thales’s Land Defence business, says: “We are proud to continue our close co-operation with SAAB. Our DJRP provides the Gripen aircraft with an outstanding level of reconnaissance capability, combined with great value for money.”
Wow. The contestants sure are laying the advertising on thick now that the tender is in its final stages. Seeing how the IAF has basically resigned itself to 'Give us SOMETHING, ANYTHING and we'll make it work!' it's likely the MoD will make its decision based on advertisements like these(backed up with bribes under the table) rather than what the IAF wants.
I feel a little bad for all these aerospace companies. They are marketing first-class products in a market where excellence is suppressed and merit is often ignored in favour of more sinister factors.
This looks like desperation from the least credible contender.
Besides, the Meteor missile will be available for others contenders too.
This is like –
Papa presented you a Bajaj – motorbike but wont let you go out of home!
60% of Gripen is and will be US product.
Remember how we still suffer by not having Cryogenic technology.
Seeking permission from US to kick bad-guys as* is too much for IAF.
Rather IAF can do this effectively with age-old Mig-21s.
thanks for your post anyway
Just a couple of thoughts on the current MMRCA farce:
1) Circa the 1980's, after the Paks got the F-16 our airforce uncles were jolted out of their post 1971 euphoria. We suddenly realised that we didn't have an answer to the F-16. The Jags, Mig-23/27, Mig-29 just didn't fill the performance void. We continued looking for an F-16 equivalent… Then the answer came in the form of the Mirage-2000. The M2K was the perfect opposing counterpart of the F-16 – in terms of technology, performance and operation. The both were like twin brothers lost in the Kumbh Mela! Perfect! So we happily went back to our 1971 europhic slumber.
2) Cut to end 1999-early 2000s, in the Kargil war the M2K proved to the IAF what a good investment it was, with the Migs bitting the dust across the border and the Jags & others coughing & wheezing and barely making the cut. And so the good old Air Marshalls said "lets go get ourselves some more M2Ks!". Unfortunately for them, by the time the govt gives the a.o.k the french shut down the M2K production line, OOPS! So now, we go back to the story of the 1980s with a twist — THIS TIME WE ARE LOOKING FOR AN EQUIVALENT OF THE MIRAGE 2000!!
3)"MIRAGE 2000 EQUIVALENT" did you say? hmmmm…lets see… remember that twin brother of the M2K lost
in the kumbh mela. Voila! The F-16IN! single-engined, middle-aged, cheap and with just enough life left in the design to last till the AMCA & PAK-FA come in. The Gripen? Nah! too close to an LCA. The MIG-35? no thanks! too many russians with us already. The others? Too heavy and an too much of an overkill.
4)So… the end of this circus was already decided. The F-16 is a perfect M2K complement, we already have enough experience running and maintaining GE engines, our avionics tech is israeli derived/assisted which is as good as saying we already operate on american avionics and only Uncle Sam can stop the Chinks from overflowing across our borders. All the pieces were in place, we only needed to put a show that we were playing a fair game and thus the MMRCA circus.
Not sure is others can, but I can't see the attachment!!
Now every competitor will be start showing carrots..
our so called politicians should take decision wisely.
jai hind
Just wait! The MMRCA is getting so much universal publicity and arousal of scientific interest, that soon the different brands of UFOs may come down with most lucrative proposals.
I am waiting for the day when the vendors will start offering a 7 day/night Thai vacation, one 2 bedroom flat in Noida/Bangalore and a Fiat Punto along with a fighter.
Why didnt I become a Sarkari Babu….sigh
Cecx Fable & Gas
Tanmay, the babus wont show any "wisedom". They will choose whoever pays the most bribe.
Can someone please help? I am not able to see the supplement. Do I need to install any browser plug-in? I have IE7 and Mozilla 3.6.
Wow..is there really a poster inside??then i am buying for sure…
Anonymous @ 9:42PM…
Get your facts checked : M2k and MIG 29 of IAF were inducted in same time frame fy 84-85.
It was the MIG-29 providing CAP to M2K during kargil that scared pAF F-16 to even try to atampt an misadventure… LOL!!!
Friends no more conversation/suggestion/arguments please.
Be clear that no output of MMRCA is coming before Obama visit.
Because I m 100% confident about our politicians and their nature towards our nation & security.They are too much caring about their own security.
See agustawestland helicopters, Boeing-747 for our political heroes and No Airbus refueler for our national heroes(IAF) because of price tag.
This is My India.
Superb stuff. An excellent example of bringing the aircraft to the people of the country. Specially liked the touch about 'The Future is Made in India'. That is an excellent proposition to put the issue in perspective. Hopefully all the other contenders bring out a similar special in a widely circulated daily so that we know what the IAF/MoD/ Government is going in for. Hope to see one on the Eurofighter and Rafale as well as the F-16 and F-18. Great going.
"contract could still be three or four years away, and that India's planned 2014 in-service date could drift to perhaps 2020. The 'first six months' took 18"
This statement was made by Bob Kemp, senior vice-president sales and marketing for Gripen International about a year ago.
It basically means that they are hoping for MOD in it's true tradition to drag its feet for a few year before taking a final decision so that SAAB could have a shot since Gripen NG is likely to be ready only after 2015.
EF too had hoped for AESA to come with Tranch 3 when they bid for MMRCA 2 years ago. But EF member states could not agree to it.
While no one should doubt MOD's capability to delay MMRCA to 2020 or even 2030, is this is what we want?
Very good read.
Some specifics are not mentioned, but it covers the Gripen's capabilites, technology, multiple roles and readiness well. Makes a very good financial case for the aircraft and domestic technology. Directly addresses the IAF's situation and needs.
Thank you for the link.
While USA is working on airborn laser kill type weaponery, with remote control pilot less plane – Indians are wasting thier money with such huge purchase despite LCA and peaceful border with Pakistan – nearly 40 years without a war, nor does India want to engage a nuclear Pakistan into it……
Source: http://www.gripen.com/en/index.htm
The Royal Thai Air Force is now a full member of the Gripen User Group, joining Sweden, Hungary, the Czech Republic and South Africa.
2010-09-02 | The Gripen User Group is a forum for Air Forces operating Gripen, providing members a unique opportunity for multinational cooperation. The group shares experiences about using the Gripen system, enabling a cost effective way for the operators to jointly develop and upgrade the system. Upgrades to Gripen are made frequently during the aircraft’s life-cycle, allowing Gripen to remain one of the most advanced fighter aircraft in the world.
Future missile system for Gripen
Source: http://www.gripen.com/en/MediaRelations/News/2010/Future_missile_system_for_Gripen.htm
Defence and security company Saab has received an order from FMV (the Swedish Defence Materiel Administration) regarding the integration of the active radar-guided Beyond Visual Range (BVR) missile, Meteor. The order is worth MSEK 312 spread over four years.
2010-09-08 | The integration means that Meteor will be adapted to other Gripen systems, such as the radar and displays. The order includes test flights and test firing, as well as the integration of Meteor with support and maintenance systems such as simulators and planning computers. The Swedish Gripen C/D aircraft will also have a two-way datalink for communication between the aircraft and the missile once it has been fired.
"Meteor has substantially better performance than any other BVR missile existing today, which will obviously increase Gripen's ability to defend against other aircraft," says Lennart Sindahl, Head of business area Aeronautics within Saab. "The fact that Gripen is also being used internationally as an airborne platform in the development of Meteor shows that we have a technical level in Sweden that few other countries can match."
Gripen has been used since 2006 as the test aircraft for the development of Meteor. Multiple missiles have been fired from Gripen to date. This experience can now be utilised for a more cost-effective integration of Meteor with the Swedish Armed Forces' Gripen C/D.
The order mainly concerns Saab's operations in Linköping and to some extent Gothenburg.
Saab serves the global market with world-leading products, services and solutions ranging from military defence to civil security. Saab has operations and employees on all continents and constantly develops adapts and improves new technology to meet customers’ changing needs.
Meteor has been designed to defeat current and future threats at beyond visual range, with an understanding performance that will totally redefine an aircraft's air combat capability. Meteor has the largest No Escape Zone of any air-to-air weapon, resulting in a long stand-off range and high kill probability that ensures air superiority and pilot survivability. The programme is on schedule to deliver the first production deliveries in 2012 and is the result of a successful six-nation European collaboration, in which Saab Dynamics of Sweden is a partner of the prime contractor, MBDA.
The Gripen is the first of the new generation fighter aircraft to enter service and the first to be used for firing Meteor, the high-tech beyond visual range missiles of the future. Using the latest available technology it is capable of performing an extensive range of air-to-air and air-to-surface operational missions and employing the latest weapons. Gripen, designed to meet the demands of current and future threats, is in service with the Swedish, Czech Republic, Hungarian and South African Air Forces and has also been ordered by the Royal Thai Air Force. The UK Empire Test Pilots´ School (ETPS) is also operating Gripen as its advanced fast jet platform for test pilots world wide.
More fuel under the wings
2010-09-21
Source:
http://www.gripen.com/en/MediaRelations/News/2010/more_fuel_under_the_wings.htm
The Gripen NG Demo is now flying with new extra large drop-tanks. Instead of the more traditional 300gallon tanks used by Gripen C/D these new external tanks can carry 450 gallons of fuel each.
Combined with added spaces for internal fuel and a more fuel efficient engine Gripen NG will get substantially longer range and more time on station. The new drop-tanks are made by RUAG in Switzerland.
Thales Digital Joint Reconnaissance Pod ready to fly on Gripen
23 September 2010
The Thales DJRP (Digital Joint Reconnaissance Pod ) will be installed on the Gripen platform.
Source: http://www.thalesgroup.com/Pages/PressRelease.aspx?id=14116
Thales today announces the delivery to Saab AB of its Digital Joint Reconnaissance Pod (DJRP), for installation on the South African Gripen aircraft. Saab will now start a series of integration flight trials. This announcement is made on the occasion of the Africa Aerospace & Defence 2010 exhibition in Cape Town, South Africa.
The Thales DJRP completed its factory integration tests at Thales’s optronics facility in Glasgow in June and will now be installed on the Gripen platform. Handover of the reconnaissance pod to the South African Air Force (SAAF) will occur after the integration phase.
Christian Lamoureux, CEO of Thales South Africa, says: “We are proud of this important milestone in our long-standing relationship with the South African Air Force. We believe DJRP will provide significant improvement to the SAAF’s reconnaissance capability. We look forward to assist the SAAF with the exploitation of DJRP imagery through Thales-supplied exploitation systems.”
The DJRP is integrated onto fighter aircraft, such as the Gripen, and takes high-resolution images of the battlefield as it flies overhead. The digital images from the pod are then exploited by Image Analysts on the ground to assess what tactical decisions need to be taken. DJRP is an ideal solution for tactical electro-optic/infra-red reconnaissance requirements, providing simultaneous high-resolution/wide-area coverage.
Alex Cresswell, Thales Vice President in charge of Thales’s Land Defence business, says: “We are proud to continue our close co-operation with SAAB. Our DJRP provides the Gripen aircraft with an outstanding level of reconnaissance capability, combined with great value for money.”