Excerpts from the draft Communication Interoperability & Security Memorandum of Agreement (CISMOA) that the US wants the Indian government to sign. Gives you a sense of why the Indian armed forces and government are so reluctant to proceed with it. The US Embassy here has been tasked with (in their words) “educating” the Indian government about how CISMOA is simply an enabler of more substantive cooperation. Livefist had the first list of the specific technologies denied to India on the C-130J as a consequence of not signing the CISMOA.
Glad that India is not signing this pact.
USA can take a walk. They talk as if they are speaking with a Pakistan or a Cuba. If they want to deal with India, they better listen to what India says and not the other way round. Interoperability to serve whom, obviously the US and definitely not India and give access to US prying eyes to all the Indian bases and inventory. NO WAY. Cant trust the Americans. They are regularly rubbing salt into our wounds and are talking sweet. All this sweet talk is good on our western neighbour but not here. The US lives in a dream world and forgets that they are dealing with India. USA we do not care about interoperability, logistics, and other agreements for the sole purpose of these is ONLY for the benefit of the USA.
These are all universal clauses applicable to all electronic military hardware, and which are mandatory for ALL buyers of US-origin MIL-STD electronic hardware. Such clauses are also always included in any contract (involving electronic hardware) that is inked between India and any other OEM, be it from Europe, Scandinavia or Russia. For example, a simple check with Indian Navy HQ's Directorate of Naval Aviation will reveal exactly how many electronic LRUs (of the Sea Harrier, for instance) have, since the late 1980s been despatched for periodic servicing to the OEM's authorised service centres located in either the UK or in Singapore. Likewise, all such hardware on board the IAF's A-50I PHALCONs will have to be despatched to Israel for major overhauls, since the IAF has only set up avionics intermediate servicing workshops in Agra.
The fact to be borne in mind is that intrusive on-site inspections of such hardware become totally irrelevant only when the concerned OEM is permitted to set up an authorised service centre in the customer's country, and such service centres–which are also capable of servicing commercial airline avionics–come under the ambit of indirect industrial offsets, which is precisely why both the European-based and US-based OEMs have requested the MoD to radically update and modify the existing DPP-related industrial offsets regulations.
Therefore, let us not go helter-skelter like headless chicken (as has been the case with TIMES NOW for the past 48 hours). Afterall, both former CAS ACM S Krishnaswamy and former CNS Admiral Vishnu Bhagwat clearly stated yesterday that India has already developed her own national secure mode (for both COMSEC and IFF) and spectrum management protocols for networks like the IACCCS and naval LINK-2, as a result of which the issue of procuring US-origin IFF/COMSEC hardware (such as CENTRIX) has, since the late 1990s, become totally irrelevant. Consequently, it would be totally incorrect to say that India's armed forces HQs are reluctant to endorse the CISMOA because, in reality, there wasn't any operational requirement for adherence to the CISMOA in the first place, a point that the two former service chiefs very clearly explained in TIMES NOW 48 hours ago.
Therefore, let us not be brainwashed by the free-for-all tamasha being churned out by the likes of Ornab Goswami (who incidentally is a service officer's son) and Srinjoy Choudhary.
screw this!!!Its a kind of irony that we pay all the money and we need their permission to run them…… the only reason that US is trying to sell all these equipments is because of their bad economy…once their economy improves they will screw us….we should go for European or Russian equipment….no matter what
Sir,
Thanks for the great updates you bring to us.
Would you consider doing an article on the repercussions of the Logistics Support Agreement (LSA), Communication and Information Security Memorandum of Agreement (CISMOA), Basic Exchange and Cooperation Agreement for Geo-Spatial Co-operation (BECA). It would be great if you could add in some American point(s)-of-view, and maybe let us know how the countries that currently sign it (who all are there?) are holding up etc. We are at a stage where if the American fighter makes it through, one does not know what to expect (in terms of access to technology).
Regards
NO MORE AMERICAN WEAPONS…The outsourcing is only like 25-30 billion of our 1.35 Trillion dollars GDP…F**K AMERICA….
As Prasun has pointed out, ALL military equipment(even Russian ones) come with such legal clauses. Some of you may recall that Russia was able to veto Indian upgrade programmes of hardware supplied by it(like MiG-23s, MiG-27s and Tu-142s) whenever India tried to do it without their permission(which they refused to grant because we wanted Israeli upgrades). They exercise the same legal powers over us that the Americans are asking for.
Eye opening and still we salivate over American hardware.
So no one knew this, thats why the US defence industry creates so many jobs 😀
Soviet equipment came with its own advisors back in the cold war days….
Saw Prasun-ji on NDTV (guess he is the same one who replied here) was totally right in his words….
We can definitely ask USA to modify the clauses which are objectionable to us. Signing CISMOA will also help us gain access to US global communication set up which is impossible for us to replicate.
Our Armed forces, netas, babus and citizens need to grow up and shed cold war era socialist mindset. If we need the best communication and intelligence gathering devices, we will have to pay a price. Nothing comes for free. It is exactly these communication systems which enabled USA to exercise complete Air, Land and Sea dominance.
To Anon@1:12PM: No, that wasn't me on NDTV. as I never give any interviews/impressions/views to any of the broadcast media agencies.
the news channel….called "Times Now" has a habit of sensationalizing every issue….don't knw why that guy called arnab goswami acts to smart…On every debate he knws only to bash the GoI….
@ Prasun K. Sengupta
We need more people like you sir, less paranoid and insecure and willing to demonstrate we can act responsibly like a future super power.
Its been more than 60 years since independence and we still have an imperial overhang, a fear of the west.
The Soviet Union has fallen, the cold war is over and the non-aligned movement is dead!
No need to get mad at the US. All the US has done is proposed an agreement for selling their thechnology to India. If GOI feels that the demends are unjust, then the GOI has the following options:
1) Negotiate some flexibility in the language
2) Accept the product without some of the sensitive technologies (Example: C-130J deal)
3) Walk away.
Americans are not forcing India to buy their equipment. All they are saying is if you want certain things then we need you to agree to CISMOA. If GOI does not like CISMOA then GOI has the option of stepping away. US owns the thchnology and therefore they get to make the rules (remember: the golden rule… he who has the gold gets to make the rules). Unlike the traditional defence supplier for India (we all know who I am talking about) the Americans have set the conditions upfront. They are not changing the rule half-way into the game. GOI knew of CISMOA long time ago, and if GOI still want the US products, but somehow think the CISMOA will just be forgotten, then that is the fault of GOI, not the US. CISMOA will not change or go away on its own; GOI will have to either negotiate or just walk away. Ball is in GOI's court and therefore GOI must decide.
We should not stop purchasing the things from US, but in defense matters we should purchase bare minimum from them and with no or minimum preconditions involved.
Any tactical item shall be purchased from US only if any same or equivalent or superior item is not available anywhere else(except sino). Regarding strategical items we shall attempt to develop the indigenous capabilities.
By not signing the CISMOA, we are being short sighted. If we are seeking strategic alliances then we will have to sign such agreements. Dragging our feet on this matter will only harm our interests. USA has Diego Garcia, hence they are not so desperate for our logistical support.Through these agreements they want to elevate our current relationship with them to a more strategic level.
Biggest stumbling block is cold war era bureaucratic mentality of our top brass, politicians and of course bureaucrats themselves.
Absolutely ridiculous. As long as Congress is there such compromising deals are possible. Let this document be vice versa with the American facilities too. This whole talk of Indo US co-operation is a bunkum.
To Gautam@9AM: During the days of the USSR when it came to inducting the Type 877EKM Kilo-class submarines into service, the Soviets had a mandatory clause which the Indian Navy had to adhere to right till the demise of the USSR: that there would be no cross-deployment of submarine crews, meaning those qualified on the Kilo would stay with them while those qualified on the Class 209/Type 1500 SSKs would not be allowed to step on board the Kilo-class SSK! Leave alone such clauses, during the Soviet era, Indian military/MoD personnel weren't even allowed to visit the factories where military hardware destined for India was being built. All that was done was once the hardware (like combat aircraft) was ready for shipment, the IAF flight conversion crew were despatched to a remote island in the Far East called Sovietskaya Gavan to begin flight conversion. The same was the case with the Kashin II-class destroyers and Kilo-class SSKs. Facilities like the ones at Nikolaev, St Petersburg (Leningrad) and Severodvinsk were strictly out of bounds for the Indians. And when the Soviet product support teams came visiting to India, they had to be accommodated in purpose-built guest houses fully equipped with perimeter fencing and satellite TV dishes, as the Soviets, being extremely paranoic about defections, never wanted their personnel to mingle with anyone else (whether in an Indian city or township) and did not want their personnel to even get a feel of what it means to have a habitat within a 'free world', even within India. That's how restrictive the terms and conditions were whenever India procured weapons from the erstwhile USSR. And here we are bitching about CISMOA, which is just a draft paper as of now!
To Hrishikesh: Well, talking about salivation over American hardware, let's expand our horizons a wee bit more than India, shall we?
1) During the early 1980s, the Soviets too salivated over US/Western hardware, and went to the extent of launching a successful covert operation aimed at obtaining CNC machining equipment from Norway and Japan and using them to fabricate the propeller blades of the Red Navy's fleet of nuclear-powered SSGNs and SSBNs.
2) The French and the British too salivated and obtained E-3D Sentry AWACS platforms from Boeing in the 1990s.
3) The Swedes are still salivating and obtaining F414 turbofans for the Gripen NG/IN.
4) The Europeans too are collectively salivating and obtaining critical on-board components for their Eurofighter EF-2000 and A400M platforms.
5) The Russians too are nowadays salivating and obtaining both design assistance and component supplies for their new-generation Sukhoi Superjet regional airliner.
6) The Chinese too never cease to salivate and they want all of it!!! So what's wrong with India salivating over US-built hardware?
To Ark [email protected]: It is not so much about paranoia or insecurity, but a matter of self-respect, as rightly pointed out by both Ronen Sen and Mani Shankar Aiyer. We must faith in our own capacities, which are growing by leaps and bounds with every passing day.
To Anon@*.42PM: Certainly, the CISMOA document will be considerably modified once the MoD decides to redraft the regulations regarding indirect industrial offsets. Once the new regulations are implemented, then the task of periodic inspections/servicing will be assumed by the OEMs who will then have their own authorised service centres within India, with the US Embassy having just a tri-services JUSMAG (Joint US Military Advisory Group) cell to oversee the smooth functioning of such authorised service centres. It's that simple. Therefore, the real debate that the likes of TIMES NOW should engage in is: what exactly is the MoD doing to expand the scope of direct OEM investments within India by redrafting the Defence Procurement Procedures (DPP) and its related direct/indirect industrial offsets clauses.
To [email protected]: What is "so compromising" about deals involving US military hardware? FYI if you were to do the math on the children of ALL senior DRDO scientists/engineers who have gone to foreign educational institutions since the early 1980s, you will find out that ALL of them have made a beeline for US-based institutions. NOT ONE of them has gone to Russia/Eastern Europe/Scandinavia/South Africa/Canada or even Western Europe. Hell, even the likes of former DRDO Chief Dr V S Arunachalam have made the US their second home! Dr Aatra, another former DRDO Chief, mastered sonar technology by going to the US. So does that mean that the entire DRDO has already been compromised? Get real, for heaven's sake!!!
I see the one-sided America haters and accusation-mongers have crept back in embarrassment at their obvious ignorance.